Talking Tea

When a listener requested an episode about teapots. we realized that this was a topic we haven't really delved into on Talking Tea. And having attended one of tea blogger, writer and teacher Scott Norton's incredibly comprehensive seminars on yixing teaware, we invited Scott to join us for an in-depth overview of teapots, their design elements, their history and how to best match your teapots with your teas.

You may remember Scott from our episode Glimpsing Tea's Past, Finding Tea's Presence, at New York's Floating Mountain.  Today we begin by chatting a bit about Scott's "teapot journey" and his background collecting, curating and teaching about teapots. And then we begin to explore various styles of Japanese and Chinese teapots. We start by comparing two very different teapots from 19th century Japan, a larger blue and white porcelain teapot and a small lotus-leaf design kyusu, and we discuss the advantages offered by small teapots in control over the brewing process and obtaining more pronounced flavors from our teas. 

As we move to Chinese teapots, we compare porcelain, glazed ceramic and unglazed clay teapots and the relative advantages and disadvantages of each. Scott chats with us about how to tell if an unglazed clay teapot is highly fired or low fired, and how the levels of firing and coarseness of the clay can create distinct differences in flavor and the results of our brewing. We also touch on the history of teapots and the influence of the Silk Road trade on teapot design and evolution in China. Scott has some rather large teapots in his collection, and we discuss when we might want to use a larger teapot and how to best use a large-size pot. Finally we chat with Scott about the questions we need to consider in matching our teapots to our teas, and Scott gives us tips on buying teapots and how shopping for a teapot can and should be an extension of our tea practice.

Scott Norton's blog is at  scotttea.wordpress.com. You can find Scott on Instagram @cutechajin, and videos of a number of Scott's workshops and seminars are available on his YouTube channel.

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

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The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

All images on this episode page, other than the header image, are courtesy of Scott Norton.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.

Header image “Raw Puerh mid 1980 Menghai” by Cosmin Dordea, used under a Creative Commons CC By-SA 2.0 license. Adapted from original.

Today we're exploring a bit of tea science on Talking Tea. We're joined by Eric Scott, a a tea scientist and researcher at Tufts University, to chat about some of the many ways a basic understanding of the science of tea can benefit us as tea consumers and tea professionals.

Eric tells us a bit about his own tea journey and the work he's doing in tea chemistry, the chemical ecology of tea and the effects of climate change on tea. We chat with Eric about how even a little knowledge of tea chemistry adds to the story behind the tea we're drinking, can enhance our enjoyment of tea and our perception of flavors, and, if we're working in the tea industry, can help us educate consumers. We look at tea's relationship with caffeine, the importance of caffeine to the tea plant and how understanding this can bust some myths about caffeine and tea. We touch on two topics relating to shou pu erh and heicha: we look at why you might want to rinse your leaves if you're drinking shou pu erh or heicha, and we look at "fermentation". Most of us in the tea world have probably heard that oolongs and black/red teas are oxidized, not fermented, but we go a little deeper into what "fermentation" actually is and why it's not what actually happens in the processing of dark teas and shou puerh, even though those are often called "fermented" or "post-fermented". 

Eric also gives us a peek into his research on the impact of climate change on tea. We chat about the effects of climate change on the monsoon season in Yunnan, and it's potentially game-changing effects on pu erh the pu erh market. We touch on the effects of drought on tea farms in India and Taiwan. And we look at Eric's work on climate change and bug-bitten teas, and how bug-bitten teas may help tea farmers succeed and innovate in the face of climate-change.

Eric's Tea Science Tuesdays video series is available on the Tea Geek YouTube channel (and sometimes on Instagram). Eric is on Instagram @leafyeric and on Twitter @leafyericscott. More on Eric and his work is at his website, ericrscott.com.

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

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The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

Image “Chemistry is Awesome!!!”, by erika.hicks, used under a Creative Commons CC By 2.0 license.  Adapted from original.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.

Header image “Raw Puerh mid 1980 Menghai” by Cosmin Dordea, used under a Creative Commons CC By-SA 2.0 license. Adapted from original.

We're delving into some sticky topics today on Talking Tea as we look at the roles mass marketing, gender, racism and modern British history have played in shaping tea markets and tea culture in the West. Joining us is historian Erika Rappaport, author of the recently published book A Thirst For Empire: How Tea Shaped the Modern World. Erika's work as a historian focuses in the areas of gender, consumer culture and British history, and "A Thirst for Empire" delves into all of these areas in looking at the forces that shaped tea culture and tea markets in the West.

Erika talks with us about how tea can shine a spotlight on the role of mass marketing in shaping modern tastes and trade. We discuss the origins of her book, exploring the long association of tea with women and feminine culture in the UK and the US. We chat about the influence of the "temperance" movements of the 19th century, promoting tea and tea culture as a healthier and spiritually beneficial alternative to alcohol, and the role of industry lobbies in promoting sweet tea in the West and especially iced tea in the US. We look at the reasons for the shift in Western consumer preference from green tea to black tea in the 19th and 20th centuries.  And we look at the disturbing use of racism and nationalism in advertising by British tea planters to promote "Empire" tea over Chinese tea, and how this eventually led to the widespread preference in the West for industrialized, mass-produced commodity tea.

A Thirst for Empire is published by Princeton University Press, and is widely available at retailers. 

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

more about Talking Tea 

Sign up for our email list to get updates on new episodes and events.

The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.

Image of British soldier drinking tea in 1944 India, © IWM (IB 1882), courtesy of the Imperial War Museum. More information on the photo is available at https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205193624

Header image “Raw Puerh mid 1980 Menghai” by Cosmin Dordea, used under a Creative Commons CC By-SA 2.0 license. Adapted from original.

Today Talking Tea is in Middlebury, Vermont, at Stone Leaf Teahouse, a unique tea space in this bucolic town. Joining us is John Wetzel, founder and owner of Stone Leaf.

The town of Middlebury may be best known for being the home of Middlebury College, but since its founding 10 years ago Stone Leaf has also become well-known in and beyond Middlebury for the quality of its teas and for the warmth and tranquility of its teahouse. We chat with John about Stone Leaf's origins, how he developed his vision for the space and for the company, and how he drew on both US coffee culture and tea culture in Asia and Europe as influences for his design. The teahouse sits partially underground (it's built into a slope), and though John half-jokingly calls it a sort of "tea cave", he also explains how he used this feature as part of his design, to create a space well-suited for the storage, preparation and enjoyment of tea, a space that allows for both focus and connection.

Stone Leaf carries a wide variety of teas, and we chat about one of their newest teas, a hongcha (red tea, known as black tea in the West) from Alishan in Taiwan. Alishan is usually known for its oolongs, and this tea is in fact made from the oolong Jin Xuan cultivar. We talk about the use of this cultivar in making a hongcha, the influence of cultivar and terroir on the tea's flavor, aroma and appearance, and about emerging trends in making new styles of teas from cultivars and regions traditionally associated with different varieties.

More information about Stone Leaf, including the location of the teahouse, its online store and special event info, is at its website, stoneleaftea.com. You can  also find Stone Leaf on Instagram at stoneleafteahouse  and on Facebook at Stone Leaf Teahouse. 

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

more about Talking Tea 

Sign up for our email list to get updates on new episodes and events.

The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.

Image of interior of Stone Leaf Teahouse, courtesy of Stone Leaf Teahouse.

Header image “Raw Puerh mid 1980 Menghai” by Cosmin Dordea, used under a Creative Commons CC By-SA 2.0 license. Adapted from original.

Most everyone is familiar with pairing wine and cheese, but pairing tea and cheese is much less well known and less understood. (By the way, that's tea in the glass in the photo above, not wine.) Some tea drinkers may even find the idea of tea and cheese pairing a bit counterintuitive, if not a bit, well, odd. But at Talking Tea we've experienced some delicious pairings of tea with cheese, so we wanted to explore the issue more in depth.

Joining us today to talk about pairing tea with cheese, and to do some pairings with us, is Lisa Boalt Richardson. Lisa is a tea writer and educator who has written and taught on the subject of pairing tea with cheese and other foods, making tea and food pairings accessible and easy to understand. We begin our chat by looking at the basic premises behind tea and food pairings from a common-sense perspective, and then we start to look specifically at pairing cheese with tea. Lisa explains why cheese and tea can pair very well together, and we chat about the importance of identifying levels of fat in cheese and astringency in tea, as well as other elements in the flavor and mouthfeel of each, in order to create excellent pairings. We discuss different goals in creating pairings, as well as different methods of tasting the tea and the cheese we're pairing. And then we do two pairings together: a triple-cream cheese paired with a first flush darjeeling, and then the same cheese with an assam, as we talk about the reasons Lisa suggested these pairings, the results of the pairings and why some pairings are likely to work better than others.

More information about Lisa Boalt Richardson, including info on her book Modern Tea: A Fresh Look at an Ancient Beverage (referenced in the episode), is at her website, lisaknowstea.com. You can  also find Lisa on Facebook at lisaknowstea. Lisa is also an instructor at the World Tea Academy; info on their courses and programs is at worldteaacademy.com.

The cheese used by Talking Tea was St. Stephen's triple-cream, made by Four Fat Fowl and purchased at DiBruno Brothers in Philadelphia. The teas Talking Tea used in our pairings were purchased at Camellia Sinensis Tea House and at Tea Dealers.

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

more about Talking Tea 

Sign up for our email list to get updates on new episodes and events.

The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.

Header image “Raw Puerh mid 1980 Menghai” by Cosmin Dordea, used under a Creative Commons CC By-SA 2.0 license. Adapted from original.

We've been wanting to explore chaxi on Talking Tea ever since we visited the Tea Institute at Penn State University back in 2016. Tea was prepared and served to us by students in the Chinese tea track at the Institute with a degree of artistry and calm precision we had never quite witnessed anywhere else, and when we asked some of the students where they learned to prepare tea in this way, they suggested we speak with one of their teachers and mentors, Stéphane Erler, to learn more about chaxi, an artistic expression of tea originating in Taiwan.

It took us a couple of years, but we finally caught up with Stéphane recently on one of his visits to the US, and we're proud to welcome him to Talking Tea. Stéphane is a tea educator, seller and blogger based in Taiwan - he hosts the very well-respected Tea Masters Blog - and, among other things, Stéphane practices, teaches and writes about chaxi. We talk with Stéphane about his own beginnings in tea, his study and work with tea master Teaparker, and about the history of chaxi in Taiwan, and then we delve into the practice and principles of chaxi.

Chaxi means "tea play", and Stéphane chats with us about how chaxi is a kind of performance but also a way of creating a tea mandala, a picture of a harmonious world through tea. We discuss the priorities of function and art within chaxi, and we explore the question of how the host can best express the character of the leaves as well as the host's own sentiments and feelings through the chaxi.  In this context we talk about the choice of teaware, the importance of colors and visual harmony, the use of flowers or plants, the addition of music or other background art, and most importantly the skills and mindset needed to prepare the best possible tea in a beautiful setting, finding resonance and harmonious connections between the tea, the teaware, the setting and the participants.

Further resources for learning about chaxi are on Stéphane's blog, teamasters.blogspot.com. Stéphane's selection of excellent teas (we've tried several of them, and they were all fantastic), teawares and other items for use in chaxi are available at his online boutique, tea-masters.com.  You can  also find Stéphane on Twitter at @TeaMastersBlog and on Instagram at @stephane_erler.

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

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Talking Tea's 2016 coverage of the Penn State Tea Institute is in our episodes Tea Goes to College and Tea, Heart to Heart. 

The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.

Photo of a chaxi by Stéphane Erler, courtesy of Stéphane Erler.

Header image “Raw Puerh mid 1980 Menghai” by Cosmin Dordea, used under a Creative Commons CC By-SA 2.0 license. Adapted from original.

Today we're chatting with Zhen Lu and Phil Rushworth of Zhen Tea about a category of tea that's not widely understood outside of China or even within China, and that's heicha, or "dark tea", hailing from outside the pu erh region. You may remember Zhen and Phil from our earlier episode "Lapsang Souchong - Beyond the Smoke", and today we're chatting at the Zhen Tea headquarters in Ottawa, Canada.

Now pu erh (at least shu pu erh) is a dark tea, and plenty of people know plenty about pu erh. But the many wonderful non-pu erh dark teas don't enjoy the same celebrity status as pu erh, and those teas are what we're focusing on in this episode. (We're intentionally avoiding the highly controversial issue of whether sheng pu erh is properly called heicha, which could be a topic for an entire episode on its own.)

Zhen and Phil carry a varied selection of dark teas, and they chat with us about the sometimes confusing nomenclature of heicha, its somewhat murky history, its regions of origin and terroir, and "wet piling", the fermentation process that makes heicha unique among all teas. We sample and discuss two dark teas - an aged Fu Zhuan from 2013, and a new experimental take on traditional Tibetan tea - as we talk about the variations of flavor and mouthfeel in non-pu erh dark teas, how the flavors differ from typical shu pu erh flavor profiles, and how these variations are influenced by terroir and growing conditions. Zhen and Phil also brief us on some of the innovations we're beginning to see in heicha and the delicacy and difficulty of the wet-piling process, and we talk about the relaxing, almost meditative, physical and mental sensations many of us experience with heicha. Zhen also gives us some tips on storing dark teas at home.

More on Zhen Tea, including its teas, teaware, online store and new online magazine Charen, is at zhentea.ca.

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

more about Talking Tea 

Sign up for our email list to get updates on new episodes and events.

The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.

Photo of Zang Cha-Gan Hong courtesy of Zhen Tea.

Header image “Raw Puerh mid 1980 Menghai” by Cosmin Dordea, used under a Creative Commons CC By-SA 2.0 license. Adapted from original.

Today we welcome back to the show Kevin Gascoyne, of Montreal's Camellia Sinensis Tea House, to chat with us in depth about how our choices of teaware impact the flavors, aromas and overall experience of the teas we drink. Kevin is often seen sporting his signature Royal Albert teacup, and that prompted us to ask Kevin what's the deal with this oh-so-English-looking cup. His initial answer inspired us to want to explore more fully how our choice of cup and brewing vessel affect our enjoyment of tea.

In our chat we focus mostly on the effects of the cup on our tea experience (though we also touch on some elements of teapots). Kevin talks with us about how the shape of the cup controls the delivery of the tea to the mouth and the placement of the tea on the tongue, how the material, size and shape of the cup affect the thermodynamics of the tea, and how all of this impacts the flavors and aromas of the tea we're drinking. We chat about some of the design features of teacups that have evolved for comfort, warmth and delivery, and also how the visual elements and aesthetics of our teaware influence our enjoyment of tea. Contrasting tea served in wine glasses and in small tasting cups as examples, Kevin points out how different styles of teaware and brewing create different moods and spaces for our experience of tea. 

We wanted to do these comparisons hands-on, so Kevin served us two teas in very different styles of cups: first with teaware from the Royal Albert collection, and then from the innovative Peter Ting tasting kit. Listen to the episode to hear the results of this tasting experiment.

For more on Camellia Sinensis, including its teaware, teas, online store and locations, go to camellia-sinensis.com.    

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

more about Talking Tea 

Sign up for our email list to get updates on new episodes and events.

The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.

Photo of Kevin Gascoyne and his Royal Albert teacup courtesy of Camellia Sinensis.

Header image “Raw Puerh mid 1980 Menghai” by Cosmin Dordea, used under a Creative Commons CC By-SA 2.0 license. Adapted from original.

As December comes to a close and winter deepens here in the northern hemisphere, we're continuing our turn inward as we conclude our two-part series on the spirit of tea as reflected in chado, the Japanese way of tea. Today we're focusing on chabana, the art of flowers so integral to Japanese tea ceremony.

To chat with us about chabana we're welcoming back Drew Hanson, an instructor in the Urasenke school of chado and founder/owner of the Boukakuan Japanese Tea House in New Jersey. (You may remember Drew from an earlier chado-related Talking Tea episode, Tea, Heart to Heart.) We're with Drew in the tea room at Boukakuan, and Drew talks with us about the guiding principles of chabana and how the flowers in the tea room relate to us as humans, mirroring our own constant state of transition and transience. Drew gives us specific guidance on how to choose and present flowers for tea, and we discuss the history of chabana and its relationship to Buddhism in Japan. We chat about bringing nature into the tea room in a very focused way, relating the flowers and their container to the season and the differences between chabana and Western traditions of flower arranging so vividly pointed out in Kakuzo Okakura's The Book of Tea.

For more info on the Boukakuan Japanese Tea House, including info on Japanese tea ceremony classes and demonstrations, go to the Boukakuan website at njgreentea.com.

Ken Cohen's audiobook edition of Kakuzo Okakura's The Book of Tea, published by Spoken Realms, is available at Audible.com , Amazon and iTunes.

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

more about Talking Tea 

Sign up for our email list to get updates on new episodes and events.

The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.

We're getting a bit contemplative this time of year here at Talking Tea, as the weather turns cooler and our bodies and minds begin to turn inward. So this December we're offering two episodes exploring the spirit of tea as reflected in chado, the Japanese way of tea. To kick off this two-part series we're looking at the life, work and influence of Kakuzo Okakura, best known for his modern classic The Book of Tea.

As some of you may know, Talking Tea host Ken Cohen narrated and produced an audiobook edition of Okakura's The Book of Tea in 2015. Today Ken is chatting via Skype with Bruce Richardson, of Elmwood Inn Fine Teas and its publishing arm Benjamin Press. Bruce wrote and published an extensive and scholarly intro to the print version of The Book of Tea, and Bruce shares a bit of his own tea journey with us and tells us how he was first drawn to this text. We discuss Okakura's early life in Japan and his exposure to the West, the origins of The Book of Tea and its connection with Okakura's work at the Boston Museum of Fine Arts, and Okakura's influence on iconic American art collector Isabella Stewart Gardner, American artist Georgia O'Keefe and the design principles of Frank Lloyd Wright. Bruce chats with Ken about Okakura's perspectives on the connections between tea, art, and Zen, and Bruce shares his own perspectives, influenced by Okakura, on tea as an adventure and a creative path, on the importance of the space within and why the way of tea is the way of life. 

Bruce Richardson's illustrated print edition of The Book of Tea, with his introduction, is available through Elmwood Inn Fine Teas or though Amazon.

Ken Cohen's audiobook edition of The Book of Tea, published by Spoken Realms, is available at Audible.com , Amazon and iTunes.

Talking Tea is produced and hosted by Ken Cohen. You can follow Ken on Twitter @kensvoiceken.   

more about Talking Tea 

Sign up for our email list to get updates on new episodes and events.

The views and opinions expressed by guests on Talking Tea are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of Talking Tea or its staff.

This podcast features music from “Japanese Flowers” (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii/japanese-flowers) by mpgiiiBEATS (https://soundcloud.com/mpgiii) available under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported license (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/). Adapted from original.