Small Business Banter

Host @Michael Kerr and @Martin Cattach , founder of Finance for Business, discuss the stranglehold the big four banks on small business lending, and explore alternative options for financing.

Martin outlines alternative #financing options, especially the diverse and fast growing range of #fintechlenders for #smallbusinesses

We cover;

1. The role of #workingcapital in business growth
2. The entanglement trap that owners often find themselves in
3. The importance of understanding your financial position
4. How to get more value from your accounting software package and bank account data
5. Planning ahead to avoid cash flow problems
6. The role of fintech lenders in providing quick and flexible funding solutions

Martin shares examples of clients he has worked with and the positive impact alternative financing has had on their businesses.\

@kerrcapital

@finforbiz

Thanks for listening.  Visit the Small Business Banter website to subscribe, listen back, or check out any resources or information mentioned on the show.

Search @SmallBusinessBanter on your favorite podcast player to subscribe and listen to the episodes.

Reach out to Michael Kerr via the website if you need personal assistance or advice for your small business.

[email protected]

www.smallbusinessbanter.com.au

@MarkRubbo from @readingsbooks shares his personal take on buying and building this iconic business. We cover a lot of ground including;

• How the opportunity to buy Readings came about
• Laving the music industry (Professor Longhair) for book retailing
• The linkage of Marks business ambitions with the impact on;
  • the Australian book industry
  • the broader literary community (writers, publishers)
  • the local community
• Mark's ambition and opportunistic mindset to expanding Readings into multiple other locations, and the establishment of an online presence
• The importance of community engagement, author events and creating a vibrant bookstore
• The physical bookshops as a unique experience, with the opportunity for discovery
• Why Government support for bookshops is crucial in preserving the cultural value they bring to communities
• Transitioning out of the CEO role and ensuring a smooth succession to maintain the unique flavor of Readings
• The challenges and rewards of running an independent bookstore
• The impact of Borders Books when it opened directly opposite in Lygon St in the early 2000's
• The impact of online retailers like Amazon
• His experiences of succession planning, and advice for other small bookshop owners - to ensure the continuity of their business and to pass on their legacy.
• He also talks about his current projects;
  • The Book Sellers podcast - https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-booksellers-podcast/id1683259417
  • #Indigenousarts
  • #literaryprizes
  • @beyondblue
• And finally what it's really like to 'move on', and hand over day to day management

QUOTES:

"Sometimes founders rightfully wrongly put everything they've got into it and other people get to benefit from it."

"I hope Readings has been a sort of community focused business."

Thanks for listening.  Visit the Small Business Banter website to subscribe, listen back, or check out any resources or information mentioned on the show.

Search @SmallBusinessBanter on your favorite podcast player to subscribe and listen to the episodes.

Reach out to Michael Kerr via the website if you need personal assistance or advice for your small business.

[email protected]

www.smallbusinessbanter.com.au

@Earl Eddings has started, sold and acquired multiple businesses. Along the way he's had high profile roles including as Chair of Cricket Australia, and served as Non Executive Director, Advisory Board member, Adviser and Mentor to other business owners and businesses. He's had wins. He's also learned a lot from experiences where things didn't go to plan. These experiences were however formative and continue to shape how he continues to approach his work, the support he provides to other business leaders and business owners.

In our discussion we cover;

• Earl's background and his journey as a business owner, including his first owned business and its sale
• Turning around businesses and the importance of planning for an exit
• The key factors to consider when selling a business, such as having a clean balance sheet and strong systems
• The significance of trust, open communication and integrity in mergers and acquisitions, as well as the importance of proper due diligence
• The importance of expert advice and representation
• Managing expectations to avoid unrealistic valuations
• Planning for an exit and the starting point, and the future vision
• Ways to increase the value of the business
• The importance of identifying potential buyers and scanning the market is highlighted
• Mitigating risks and ensuring sustainability
• Working with the buyer and transitioning
• The use of non-binding indicative offers and deal negotiations
• Why to avoid lengthy exclusivity periods is emphasized
• The vital importance of personal aspirations and family considerations
• The role of non-executive directors and advisory boards
• Why seeking guidance and building networks is encouraged as a way to navigate the complexities of selling a business

Some of the key takeaways;

1. When starting a business, it's important to have an exit plan in mind and be prepared for a potential sale.
2. #Culturalfit and alignment of strategic intent are crucial considerations in mergers and acquisitions.
3. Plan for an exit by starting with a clear vision of the future.
4. Identify potential buyers and scan the market to find the right fit.
5. Consider personal aspirations and family dynamics when planning for an exit.
6. Engage non-executive directors and #advisoryboards for guidance and support.
7. Build networks and seek guidance from experienced professionals.

@kerrcapital @michaelkerr

Thanks for listening.  Visit the Small Business Banter website to subscribe, listen back, or check out any resources or information mentioned on the show.

Search @SmallBusinessBanter on your favorite podcast player to subscribe and listen to the episodes.

Reach out to Michael Kerr via the website if you need personal assistance or advice for your small business.

[email protected]

www.smallbusinessbanter.com.au

@Pete Seligman talks about and #eta (Entrepreneur through Acquisition) and #searchfunds and their impact on small business owners. He's an investor and co-owner of multiple businesses.

Pete explains the concept of search funds and how they provide a vehicle for investors to back #acquisitionentrepreneurs.

We talk about;

• the importance of finding the right fit between the entrepreneur and the business
• current market challenges and opportunities
• how business owners should handle an approach from a search fund or investors
• the role of #earnouts in business sales and how they can bridge the gap between buyer and seller
• the common misunderstandings in relation to earnouts, and the potential benefits they can offer
• creative deal making and risk sharing to improve the prospects for getting a successful transaction
• why business owners need to augment their existing advisors with subject matter experts for a sale process
• the importance for owners to reflect on their mission and have honest conversations with co-owners to align their goals

Takeaways

• Search funds provide a pathway for entrepreneurs to buy existing businesses instead of starting one.
• The fit between the entrepreneur and the business is crucial for success.
• Business owners should be open to conversations with search funds and investors, as it can lead to new opportunities.
• Co-investing and joint ventures can be options for owners who want to grow their business with additional capital and expertise.
• Owners should be prepared for potential exit opportunities and have a clear understanding of their role in the business. Earn outs can be a valuable tool in bridging the gap between buyer and seller in a business sale.
• Creative deal making and risk sharing are essential for a successful transaction.
• Owners should consider the potential benefits of earnouts and not reject the concept of deferred payment outright.
• Business owners may need to augment their advisors with additional expertise for a sale process.
• Reflecting on the owner's mission and having honest conversations with co-owners are crucial for aligning goals.

@kerrcapital

Thanks for listening.  Visit the Small Business Banter website to subscribe, listen back, or check out any resources or information mentioned on the show.

Search @SmallBusinessBanter on your favorite podcast player to subscribe and listen to the episodes.

Reach out to Michael Kerr via the website if you need personal assistance or advice for your small business.

[email protected]

www.smallbusinessbanter.com.au

@Sandy Chong brings 39 years experience as a salon owner to her current role as CEO at @The Australian Hairdressing Council. She's the current @cosboa #smallbusinesschampion and has multiple other board and advisory roles that involve advocacy and improving effectiveness for industry bodies.

Sandy sold her own salon during 2023 to focus on her CEO role. In that role she is actively involved in advocating for small businesses and shaping the future of the industry. Her extensive background as a business owner gives her valuable insights to guide those aspiring to venture into entrepreneurship and business ownership after completing their trade apprenticeships.

In our discussion we talk about;

• the crucial role industry bodies play in supporting and advocating for small businesses
• the importance of education and training in helping #apprentices become skilled professionals, and then business owners
• how vital apprenticeships are for the growth and sustainability of industries
• why small businesses, like hairdressing salons, have such a significant impact on the community and contribute to people's self-esteem and mental wellness
• nurturing and developing homegrown talent
• navigating the impact of Government Regulations on hairdressers
• addressing #skillshortages and Workforce Sustainability in trades
• what she learnt running a salon with up to 45 staff (all but 1 apprenticed by Sandy!) over 39 years
• shedding light on the unique challenges and opportunities within the hairdressing industry
• inspiring entrepreneurs in the trades industry

I think hairdressers often give back and I think that's one thing that really stands out for me, is they have really incredible business structures. They're incredibly generous to their staff, but it's the community generosity. - Sandy Chong

Visit the Australian Hairdressing Council website at www.ahc.org.au to learn more about the organization and its initiatives.

Timestamped summary of this episode:

00:00:12 - Introduction and Purpose of the Podcast
Michael Ker introduces the Small Business Banter podcast and its relevance to business owners, especially those looking to sell or buy a new business. He emphasizes the stress, emotions, and challenges involved in these processes.

00:01:21 - Sandy Chong's Background and Role
Sandy Chong shares her extensive background as the CEO of the Australian Hairdressers Council and her experience as a past salon owner for 39 years. She highlights the importance of developing relationships with clients and the unique challenges of the hairdressing industry.

00:07:20 - Career Opportunities in Hairdressing
Discussion on the potential career opportunities in the hairdressing industry, including the potential for financial success, international work, and diverse roles beyond salon ownership. Emphasis on the importance of education and training for career growth.

00:09:50 - Apprenticeship and Business Ownership
Sandy Chong reflects on her commitment to apprenticing her staff and the importance of finding the right buyer for her salon. She discusses the need for a pathway to guide talented practitioners toward business ownership and the challenges of running a business.

00:14:59 - Industry Support and Sustainability
Sandy Chong emphasizes the role of industry associations in educating and supporting business owners, particularly in navigating complex issues such as industrial relations and HR. The importance of belonging to an association for access to industry-specific information and support is highlighted.

00:16:25 - Migration Review and Industry Concerns
Sandy discusses the release of the migration review and expresses concern for the hairdressing industry's exclusion due to high sponsorship costs. She highlights the industry's need for sustainability and lower tismet.

00:17:37 - Challenges and Solutions for the Industry
Sandy addresses the skill shortage in the predominantly female hairdressing industry and emphasizes the importance of investing in apprenticeships and adapting to the changing preferences of younger workers. She also mentions the potential benefits of new jobs and skills councils.

00:19:38 - Encouraging School-Based Apprenticeships
Sandy discusses the potential of school-based apprenticeship programs and the benefits of group training organizations for higher completion rates. She also highlights the challenges faced by single operator salons and the financial barriers for young people entering the industry.

00:21:41 - Financial Management and Small Business Challenges
The conversation shifts to the financial challenges faced by small business owners, particularly in managing cash flow, profit and loss, and the complexities of industrial relations. Sandy emphasizes the need for education and support in understanding basic finances and business value.

00:32:01 - The Value of Small Businesses in Communities
Sandy and the host highlight the vital role of small businesses, including hairdressing, in supporting community well-being and mental health. They emphasize the personal and social aspects of the hairdressing experience, going beyond just a haircut.

00:33:05 - Passion for Small Business and Cosboa Small Business Champion Award
Sandy Chong discusses her deep passion for small business and receiving the Cosboa Small Business Champion Award in April. She highlights her role as an ambassador and her commitment to lobbying and advocacy work for small businesses.

00:35:36 - Driving Force behind Small Business Ownership
Sandy Chong shares her motivation for becoming a small business owner, emphasizing the inclusivity and culture of the hairdressing industry. She also discusses her desire to be a successful business person and contribute to the industry through education and training.

00:37:01 - The Mindset of Small Business Owners
The conversation delves into the mindset of small business owners, highlighting their humble beginnings, lack of strategic planning, and the drive to seize opportunities. The discussion also touches on the purpose, financial benefits, and challenges of small business ownership.

00:40:38 - Small Business Heroes and Inspirational Figures
Sandy Chong mentions several inspirational figures in the hairdressing industry, recognizing their ethical standards, charitable work, and community generosity. She emphasizes the impact of these individuals on the industry and their ability to inspire the next generation of small business owners.

00:43:22 - Reaching Out to Sandy Chong
Sandy Chong provides information on how to reach out to her as the CEO of the Australian Hairdressing Council and the current small business champion. She encourages individuals to visit the council's website and emphasizes her accessibility for inquiries and support.

Thanks for listening.  Visit the Small Business Banter website to subscribe, listen back, or check out any resources or information mentioned on the show.

Search @SmallBusinessBanter on your favorite podcast player to subscribe and listen to the episodes.

Reach out to Michael Kerr via the website if you need personal assistance or advice for your small business.

[email protected]

www.smallbusinessbanter.com.au

@JonathanRoberts co-founded @OneRabbit with 2 partners 10 years ago. He'd worked with those same partners for 17 years prior in a marketing and design business, which ultimately morphed into One Rabbit.

Along the way he's founded, owned and exited multiple other businesses. In this episode and based on that deep experience as an entrepreneur Jonathan shares high value insights on the challenges and rewards of making a strategic exit. Specifically he talks about;

• how 3 partners exited their marketing firm with friendship Intact
• the importance of recognizing when passion and energy wane
• how assessing one's satisfaction and enthusiasm regularly can be pivotal in determining the right time for a change
• the significance of exit planning, building systems into the business, diversifying income streams, and maximizing profits
• his unconventional approach to exit planning
• his success in transitioning to new ventures
  • @ZeroWasteProject
  • @fridgefriend
• the value of finding new passion and purpose beyond the business

A must-listen for potential business sellers and entrepreneurs seeking to exit on their terms and with confidence.

"Enjoy it, stay there while you enjoy it, make it as profitable as you can. And then when you stop enjoying it, pull the trigger, move on." - Jonathan Roberts

RESOURCES:

1. Visit www.zerowasteproject.com.au to explore the Zero Waste Project and learn more about their products and initiatives
2. Search for www.fridgefriend.com.au to find the domestic product offered by Zero Waste Project and discover how it can help reduce food waste at home
3. Connect with Jonathan Roberts on LinkedIn for further insights and updates on his entrepreneurial journey and business ventures.

Timestamped summary of this episode:

00:00:06 - Introduction and Purpose of the Podcast
Michael Kerr introduces the Small Business Banter podcast and discusses its focus on business owners at different stages of ownership, such as selling, being approached by potential buyers, or aspiring to buy a new business.

00:01:13 - Guest Introduction and Business Background
Jonathan Roberts shares his extensive background in sales and marketing, including founding and growing One Rabbit, a professional services marketing firm. The discussion touches on the unique approach taken by One Rabbit and its transition into a consulting firm.

00:05:42 - The Transition to One Rabbit and Business Philosophy
Jonathan explains the transformation of One Rabbit, emphasizing the decision to focus solely on professional service firms. The discussion also delves into the philosophy behind the name "One Rabbit" and the shift towards a no BS approach in marketing.

00:09:27 - Knowing When to Wind Up a Business
Jonathan discusses the natural progression towards winding up One Rabbit after 27 years, citing a loss of enthusiasm and a desire to pursue other business interests. The impact of COVID-19 and the exploration of potential alternatives, including selling the business, are also mentioned.

00:16:55 - Navigating Business Partnerships and Personal Reflection
The conversation touches on the dynamics of business partnerships, personal attachment to a business, and the gratitude for accomplishments over 27 years. Jonathan shares insights on communication within partnerships and the departure of co-founders.

00:17:23 - The Importance of Conscious Business Decision-making
Jonathan discusses the importance of conscious decision-making when it comes to exiting, not exiting, or selling a business. He emphasizes the need to have a plan and be aware of the options available.

00:19:27 - The Trade-off in Exiting a Business
Jonathan shares his experience of stepping away from his business after 27 years. He discusses the factors that led to the decision, including being passionate about other business opportunities and feeling less motivated in the current one.

00:25:32 - Renewed Purpose in New Ventures
Jonathan talks about his new business ventures related to reducing food waste and the positive impact it has. He highlights the renewed vigor and purpose he feels in his current endeavors, compared to his previous consulting business.

00:28:51 - The Entrepreneurial Spirit and Continuous Growth
Jonathan discusses his entrepreneurial spirit and the excitement of building new businesses. He emphasizes the importance of continuously investing time and energy into new ventures and the satisfaction it brings.

00:31:23 - Maximizing Earnings and Exit Planning
Jonathan advises business owners to maximize their earnings while in the business and invest in exit planning. He acknowledges the challenges of selling a business and the need for conscious decision-making throughout the process.

00:34:27 - Building Business Systems
Jonathan reflects on the need for more business systems in their knowledge-based business to diversify income streams and maximize profits. He emphasizes the importance of smart marketing and working with enjoyable clients.

00:37:18 - Becoming an Expert
Jonathan discusses the bravery required to say no to clients and the importance of becoming an expert in a specific niche to command higher fees and provide better service.

00:38:05 - Exit and Succession Planning
Jonathan shares his perspective on exit planning, emphasizing the importance of enjoying the business, making it profitable, and recognizing the right timing to move on.

00:39:40 - Finding Jonathan
Jonathan provides information about his website and encourages listeners to connect with him for further discussions or inquiries about his business.

00:40:46 - Wrapping Up
The host, Michael Kerr, concludes the episode, encourages listeners to subscribe, and offers personal assistance through the website. He also announces the release of new episodes every couple of weeks.

Thanks for listening.  Visit the Small Business Banter website to subscribe, listen back, or check out any resources or information mentioned on the show.

Search @SmallBusinessBanter on your favorite podcast player to subscribe and listen to the episodes.

Reach out to Michael Kerr via the website if you need personal assistance or advice for your small business.

[email protected]

www.smallbusinessbanter.com.au

@ShaneCheek is the CEO of @ContinuaSoftware which is a private company that specialises in acquiring, operating and growing B2B software companies.

Shane is an experienced founder, builder, business seller and investor. His expertise and practical insights make this episode a must-listen for #businessowners who are potential sellers looking to understand the best strategies to sell their business, especially when they are selling to an industry buyer. In this episode we cover;

• how to best manage the process of selling your business to an industry buyer
• the fast growing trend of #searchfund buyers making direct approaches to business owners
• how to best prepare for a direct approach
• preparing for sale negotiations
• understanding the value of your company
• the importance of building relationships with potential acquirers
• how to effectively qualify incoming inquiries from a search fund or industry buyer
• navigating negotiations with #privateequity buyers like a pro
• preparing for a fulfilling life after selling
• the crucial role of trusted advisors in the selling process

"People are messy, businesses are messy, people are imperfect, and businesses are imperfect as well. Acknowledging that and then approaching any potential transaction or sale with that as a realization makes things smoother and hopefully more enjoyable and fun along the way as well" - Shane Cheek

Visit @continuasoftware.com to learn more about Continua Software and their focus on acquiring businesses in the software and technology space.

Contact Shane at [email protected] to connect with him regarding business opportunities or discussions related to small businesses in the software and technology sector.

Timestamped summary of this episode:

00:00:06 - Introduction to Small Business Banter podcast

Michael Kerr introduces the Small Business Banter podcast, highlighting its focus on business owners and their advisors at various stages of business ownership.

00:02:34 - Continua Software and Outreach Model

Shane Cheek discusses Continua Software's focus on acquiring B2B software companies and their outreach model to directly connect with business owners. He emphasizes the importance of building relationships and understanding the people behind the businesses.

00:10:14 - Reasons for Considering an Exit

Shane highlights the reasons why business owners consider selling their businesses, including reaching a plateau, feeling tired, and personal factors such as upcoming travel or personal fulfillment.

00:14:30 - Importance of People in Acquisition

Shane emphasizes the significance of prioritizing people in business acquisitions, focusing on aligning values and building rapport with business owners. He discusses the importance of understanding owner's goals beyond financial aspects.

00:17:22 - Flexible Operating Model and Partnership

Shane explains Continua Software's flexible approach to business acquisition, accommodating varying levels of owner involvement post-acquisition. He emphasizes the importance of aligning owner's strengths with the business's needs for mutual success.

00:20:46 - Challenges in Business Transition

Shane discusses the tensions and challenges in making new business decisions, especially for sellers who have built successful businesses.

00:23:39 - Key Elements of a Good Business Opportunity

Shane highlights the importance of consistency, predictability, and clarity of roles and responsibilities in evaluating a business opportunity.

00:27:28 - Importance of Building Relationships

Shane emphasizes the importance of building a relationship with the owner of the business, comparing it to dating and marriage, and the role of a good advisor in the process.

00:31:48 - The Role of an Advisor in Selling a Business

Shane discusses the significance of having an advisor to guide the seller in the sale process, and the impact of having an advisor on the certainty of closing the deal.

00:39:32 - Managing Inquiries and Interest

Shane addresses the increasing inquiries to owners from various sources, emphasizing the need for credibility and genuine interest in potential buyers, and the importance of managing the pipeline effectively.

00:41:47 - Qualifying Inbound Inquiries

The owner needs to quickly validate the quality and intentions of inbound inquiries. Key questions to ask: Why do you want to buy my business? What is your capital source? What are your values and alignment?

00:44:28 - Evaluating Potential Buyers

It's important to assess the track record and intentions of potential buyers. Owners should approach incoming inquiries as they would a long-term sales prospect or a potential business partner.

00:47:48 - Initial Steps in the Sale Process

After an initial conversation, gathering historical financials, customer lists, and staff lists is crucial. Advisors can help prepare the business for sale by cleaning up and organizing key information.

00:55:53 - Reflecting on Business Performance

Owners should reflect annually on their business performance, similar to the process of preparing for an exit. Making 1% improvements in the business can have a significant impact over time.

01:01:34 - Understanding the Buyer

Understanding the motivations and playbook of potential buyers, such as private equity firms, is crucial in the sale process. Each buyer may have a different approach and set of expectations.

01:02:14 - Private Equity Playbook

Shane explains the private equity playbook, including initial approach, attractive evaluation, period of exclusivity, and strict due diligence process.

01:03:24 - Understanding the Buyer

Shane emphasizes the importance of understanding the type of buyer and being prepared for potential retrading, annoyance, and invasive due diligence process.

01:04:50 - Post-Sale Considerations

The discussion focuses on the emotional impact of selling a business, filling the void after the sale, and the importance of planning for life after the sale.

01:07:18 - Setting a Walk-Away Number

Shane advises on setting a walk-away number and emphasizes the significance of understanding the cash flow implications of the headline offer.

01:13:03 - Embracing Imperfections

Shane discusses the importance of acknowledging the imperfections in businesses and how being upfront about them can lead to smoother transactions and problem-solving approaches.

Thanks for listening.  Visit the Small Business Banter website to subscribe, listen back, or check out any resources or information mentioned on the show.

Search @SmallBusinessBanter on your favorite podcast player to subscribe and listen to the episodes.

Reach out to Michael Kerr via the website if you need personal assistance or advice for your small business.

[email protected]

www.smallbusinessbanter.com.au

@Ben Tuszynski from @Judo Bank, shares his insights on the importance of banking relationships for small business owners.

Ben is currently the Managing Director of Judo Bank in Victoria and Tasmania. He has over a decade of experience in the banking and finance sector. Joining Judo in 2017 as one of the pioneering employees, Ben has played a pivotal role in the bank's substantial growth over the years.

His primary focus lies in supporting small and medium-sized enterprises, aligning with Judo's commitment to providing tailored financial solutions to businesses, in an age of #industrialisedbanking.

Our conversation covers;

• Judo's nimble and responsive approach to #smebanking
• The four C's of credit
• Ben's tips for business owners, such as the value of having open discussions with banking professionals
• What to do if you're feeling frustrated by the lack of support and opportunities from your current bank
• Trusted advisors for small businesses
• Vendor finance in #businesstransitions
• Explore better banking relationships through skilled finance brokers

"No one business is the same from the other, so how do you industrialize that whole process? We really want to have a look at what's their management experience, what's their skill set, how have they gone through the ups and downs of the economy and weathered those storms?" Ben Tuszynski

Timestamped summary of this episode:

00:00:14 - Introduction and Technical Difficulties
Michael and Julie from Judo talk about technical issues regarding Ben's recording for the podcast.

00:03:13 - Catching Up and Personal Background
Ben and Michael catch up on their personal backgrounds, discussing Ben's move back from Perth and his role at Judo.

00:07:02 - Judo's Mission and Target Audience
Ben explains Judo's mission and target audience, focusing on small and medium-sized enterprises (SMEs) with turnover up to $100 million.

00:13:07 - Judo's Approach and Importance of Personalized Banking
Ben elaborates on Judo's approach, highlighting the importance of personalized banking relationships for SMEs and the industrialization of the banking market.

00:17:21 - The Importance of Reviewing Banking Relationships
Michael and Ben emphasize the importance of reviewing banking relationships and the role of a trusted banker in supporting the growth and success of SMEs.

00:20:02 - Importance of Collaborating with Accountants and Business Coaches
Ben emphasizes the importance of engaging with accountants and business coaches to navigate complex business situations and provide added value to customers.

00:21:48 - Judo's Customer Base and Industry Focus
Ben discusses Judo's industry-agnostic approach, catering to SMEs across various sectors such as accommodation, manufacturing, financial services, and property investment.

00:25:17 - The Four C's of Credit
Ben explains Judo's credit assessment framework based on character, capacity, capital, and collateral, with a focus on character and the ability to walk the factory floor for a deeper understanding of the business.

00:29:39 - Importance of Credible Cash Flow Forecasts
Ben emphasizes the significance of credible cash flow forecasts and the business owner's ability to endorse and explain the assumptions, fostering trust and communication in the lending relationship.

00:33:29 - Funding Opportunities for Growing Businesses
Ben highlights Judo's approach to lending against trading businesses, supporting growth plans beyond traditional equity in property and enabling businesses to access funding based on their strong balance sheet and income generation.

00:35:25 - Understanding Debt Servicing Capability
Ben explains the importance of understanding a client's capability to service debt on a case-by-case basis. He emphasizes the need for deeper conversations and not missing out on growth opportunities.

00:36:43 - Business Growth and Financing
Ben discusses the dynamics between business owners and potential buyers when it comes to taking on debt for growth. He highlights the role of trusted relationships and the importance of considering alternative financing options.

00:40:54 - Vendor Finance and Business Sales
Ben and Michael explore the concept of vendor finance and its potential in facilitating business sales. They emphasize the need for effective structuring and collaboration between the buyer, seller, and banker.

00:43:32 - Loyalty Tax and Customer Relationships
Ben delves into the concept of "loyalty tax" and emphasizes the importance of delivering strong relationships and support to existing customers. He also discusses the role of finance brokers as an effective channel for improving banking relationships.

00:47:34 - Economic Outlook and SME Support
Ben shares his views on the economic outlook for small and medium-sized enterprises (SMEs), highlighting factors such as labor market conditions, property market trends, and sector-specific considerations. He reaffirms Judo's dedication to supporting SMEs.

00:53:09 - Building Trust and Long-Term Relationships
Ben discusses the importance of building long-term relationships with customers and becoming Australia's most trusted SME bank. The focus is on delivering quick and confident solutions to customers for their business needs.

00:53:46 - The Value of Banking Relationships
Ben emphasizes the importance of evaluating the effectiveness of banking relationships and suggests reaching out to judo or a finance broker for a better understanding. The conversation highlights the mission of fintechs like judo in providing special opportunities to clients.

00:54:19 - Experienced Business Bankers at Judo
Ben reinforces the fact that judo, as a new bank, is staffed with experienced business bankers. He encourages businesses to start chipping away at any loyalty tax they may be paying and acknowledges the efforts of other fintechs in the industry.

00:55:11 - Access to Opportunities and Different Ways of Financing
The conversation touches on how judo and other fintechs have enabled clients to tap into opportunities that may not have been accessible before. The focus is on freeing up capital and exploring different ways of financing for businesses.

00:55:33 - Ways to Reach Out to Judo
Ben shares the various ways to reach out to judo, either through their website, phone, or LinkedIn. He emphasizes their willingness to help and collaborate with businesses, concluding the conversation with a message of appreciation for the opportunity to share insights about judo.

Thanks for listening. 

For any questions contact Michael Kerr

[email protected]

www.smallbusinessbnater.com.au

@Stu Gregor

Stu and his @fourpillarsgin co-founders recently sold the last 50% of their business to Vanguard Luxury Brands, the Lion-owned distribution business. Four Pillars is an Australian success story.

Stu's has a lengthy background in food, wine, hospitality and travel. His other business and personal experiences include;

• Founding @LiquidIdeas in 2013 - Australia's leading communications agency for food, drink, travel and lifestyle brands
• Co-owning of luxury travel business Gregor & Lewis Bespoke Travel
• President of the Australian Distillers Association (2014-current)
• Director RUOK Day and OzHarvest for nine years
• Former panellist on ABC's Gruen and regular media commentator
• Masters in Marketing from the Melbourne Business School
• Diploma in Wine Marketing from Adelaide University
• Graduate of the AICD.
• Has a daughter, a son, a wife and a passion for every sport imaginable.

We discuss;

• starting a business,
• going through an exit
• contemplating life after that business
• the power and importance of marketing
• the value of external counsel in important business decisions
• how to prepare for a business exit and ensure a smooth transition when the time comes to move on
• the importance of passion in small business - learn how to harness your enthusiasm and drive to create a thriving and fulfilling venture.

Stu opens up about the emotional aspect of selling a business, the need for a strong plan for what comes next and debunks a some myths.

Myth #1: Exiting a business means you've made it and can retire happily.

Myth #2: Life after a business exit is all relaxation and no challenges.

Myth #3: The traditional concept of work-life balance

Timestamped summary of this episode:
00:00:01 - Introduction
Stu Gregor is the guest on the Small Business Banter Podcast. He discusses his recent sale of Four Pillars gin and his role as co-founder of Liquid Ideas.

00:02:16 - Background and Experience
Stu shares his journey from journalism to the wine industry and eventually founding Liquid Ideas, a communications agency. He highlights the value of being both an advisor and a doer in business.

00:07:08 - Lessons Learned from Four Pillars
Stu reflects on his experience with Four Pillars gin and the lessons he learned as he built the brand. He acknowledges the value of lived experience and how it enhances his advisory role.

00:09:09 - Transition and Future Plans
Stu discusses the challenges of transitioning out of Four Pillars and the conflicting advice he receives about what to do next. He expresses his energy and excitement for new ventures and ideas.

00:10:45 - Uncertainty and Possibilities
Stu shares his current state of uncertainty and the various ideas he has for his future endeavors. He highlights his desire for change and the constant generation of new possibilities.

00:15:13 - The Role of the Ex Co-founder
Stu Gregor discusses his role as the ex co-founder of Four Pillars and compares it to being a loose player in the back line in the AFL. He highlights the freedom he had to roam and go where he pleased, without an official role.

00:18:29 - The Genesis of Four Pillars
Stu shares the story of how Four Pillars started in the back of a friend's shed in the Yarra Valley. He explains how they raised money from 20 investors and focused on building the best gin distillery business, without initially considering an exit plan.

00:21:18 - Building Something Worthy of Attention
Stu emphasizes the importance of building something successful before considering an exit plan. He cautions against starting a business with the sole intention of getting out, and highlights the need to be all in and passionate about what you're building.

00:23:35 - Timing and Luck
Stu acknowledges the role of timing and luck in the success of Four Pillars. He mentions that they entered the gin industry at a time when there were fewer competitors, giving them an early mover advantage. He also highlights the need for a world-class product to stand out in a crowded market.

00:26:04 - Expertise and Industry Knowledge
Stu emphasizes the importance of expertise and industry knowledge, citing their combined 50 years of experience in the drinks industry as a major advantage. He advises aspiring entrepreneurs to assess

00:31:37 - The Beginning of Four Pillars Gin
The guest talks about how Four Pillars Gin started gaining recognition, winning awards, and expanding its distribution. They emphasize the importance of not just having a great product, but also marketing and selling it effectively.

00:32:57 - Building a Business
The guest explains that their goal was to create a viable business that would employ many people and contribute to the development of the gin category. They reflect on their success in creating unique gin flavors and establishing themselves as a leading brand in Australia.

00:34:21 - Attracting Attention
The guest shares that larger spirits companies, like Diageo, started taking notice of Four Pillars Gin's success. They had meetings with representatives of these companies, who expressed interest and admiration for their brand. This sparked the guest's curiosity about potential opportunities for the business.

00:37:02 - Seeking Advice
The guest realizes the need for external advice and engages the services of Canterbury Partners, an advisory firm specializing in mergers and acquisitions. They stress the importance of getting expert guidance in navigating the complex process of potential acquisition or investment.

00:40:58 - Getting Expert Counsel
The guest emphasizes the value of having external counsel during negotiations with potential buyers. They believe that having a third party advocate for your interests can help maintain a positive relationship with the buyer and prevent conflicts that may arise during the negotiation process.

00:46:55 - Building a Strong Relationship with the Buyer
The guest discusses the ups and downs of the deal but emphasizes the importance of having a strong relationship with the buyer, which provides comfort and allows for continued investment in the business processes.

00:47:30 - Challenges and Distractions in 2019
The guest shares that finalizing the deal in 2019 was a stressful process as it required a lot of time and expertise. They also mention their decision to sell only 50% of the business and work on unfinished projects.

00:49:13 - Navigating the Challenges of 2020
The guest discusses the impact of the pandemic on their business, with international markets and on-premise markets closing down. They had to adapt by selling gin online, delivering cocktails, and even making hand sanitizer.

00:51:23 - Negotiating the Second Tranche of the Sale
The guest talks about how the pandemic affected the mechanics of the second tranche of the sale and the need to renegotiate the terms. It took several months to reach an agreed price that would benefit both parties.

00:54:57 - The Importance of Building a Brand
The guest emphasizes that a brand is the most valuable asset in the industry. Buyers are not just interested in physical assets but also in the brand's customer loyalty, awareness, and love. Building a brand can differentiate a business and make it more attractive for sale.

01:04:02 - The Challenges of Small Business
Stu emphasizes that starting and running a small business is challenging but incredibly satisfying. He encourages people to pursue their passions and find work that stimulates and fulfills them.

01:05:21 - Work-Life Balance and Personal Growth
Stu discusses the concept of work-life balance and suggests that if work is enjoyable and fulfilling, the need for balance diminishes. He shares how his experiences in small business have helped him grow as a person and become a better human.

01:06:30 - The Relentless Slog of Small Business
Stu acknowledges that running a small business is a relentless and challenging journey. However, he highlights that the hard work can be highly gratifying and invigorating, especially if you are passionate about what you do.

01:07:17 - Leaving with Grace and Planning for the Future
Stu advises that when the time comes to exit a small business, it's important to do so gracefully and not criticize or undermine those who take over. He also emphasizes the need to have a plan for what comes next to maintain a sense of purpose and fulfillment.

01:08:21 - Reaching Out to Stu
Stu shares that anyone interested in connecting with him can reach out to him on LinkedIn. He thanks Michael for the conversation and expresses his enjoyment.

@Garik Tate has more than a decade of experience as a successful entrepreneur. He grew up in small business family and founded companies spanning Software Development, Outsourcing, and Publishing with up to 75 employees.

Garik is a sought-after speaker on AI’s future, and its practical application in business. His expertise and passion for the subject have earned him a reputation as a respected voice in the AI community, and he is often sought out by companies looking for advice on how to leverage the power of AI to drive growth and success.

Our discussion focuses on how to incorporate #AI into #exitplanning for small business owners. You'll understand how to;

• Maximize the value of your small business with AI-driven planning strategies
• Boost your small business operations with the power of AI
• Discover the benefits and strategies of outsourcing to elevate your small business
• Solve small business problems faster and more efficiently with no-code AI tools

www.valhalla.team - Product Development

www.2xyou.com - Virtual Assistant

www.blvnp.com - Publishing

@michael kerr

Timestamped summary of this episode:

00:00:03 - Introduction to Garrick Tate
Garrick Tate is an AI futurist, investor, and AI strategy consultant with a decade of entrepreneurial experience. He has founded and led successful companies in software development, outsourcing, and publishing, specializing in AI, IQ, and EQ.
00:01:14 - The Role of Outsourcing in Exit Planning
Garrick discusses how outsourcing can be used in exit planning to increase profits and ultimately raise the value of a business. He emphasizes the importance of utilizing AI and automation to free up human resources for more complex tasks.
00:07:07 - The Value of Human Intelligence
Despite the rise of AI, Garrick highlights the unique complexities and capabilities of human intelligence. He believes that humans are still the best assets in business and that their potential should be fully utilized alongside AI technologies.
00:09:55 - The Last Mile Upgrade in Exit Planning
Garrick introduces the concept of the "last mile upgrade" in exit planning, which involves integrating the latest technologies, such as AI and automation, to remove constraints and significantly increase a business's potential value before a potential acquisition.
00:11:16 - Considering the Decision to Sell or Keep a Business
Garrick discusses the factors to consider when deciding whether to sell or keep a business. He emphasizes the importance of reducing owner dependency, increasing EBITDA, and factoring in opportunity costs before making a decision.
00:17:19 - Introduction,
Garik Tate explains the various components of the business, including the VA company and software company. He focuses on the new offering related to exit planning and how they help businesses remove constraints and reduce risk to increase acquisition potential.
00:19:19 - Detailed Process Analysis,
Garik discusses their process of creating a whiteboard diagram of every process in a company, from prospecting to sales to fulfillment. They then create a metrics dashboard to track key performance indicators and identify constraints. With this information, they provide a prescription list of areas to address within 90 days.
00:20:08 - Theory of Constraints,
Garik explains the theory of constraints, emphasizing the importance of identifying and removing the biggest constraints in a business. He mentions the 90-day window as a timeframe to focus on the lowest hanging fruit that contribute to constraint removal and capacity adjustment.
00:23:29 - Opportunities in Remote and Local Businesses,
Garik notes that the theory of constraints applies to any industry, but their specialization in remote and internet-based businesses allows them to control inputs and outputs through software and remote teams. He also highlights the potential for digitizing customer interactions in local businesses.
00:27:40 - Implementing AI and Automation,
Garik shares an example of improving their VA company's recruitment process through systematization and tripling the number of people processed. He emphasizes the importance of clear inputs and the possibility of adding AI and automation to processes once they are systematized.
00:36:13 - The Value of No Code Tools,
No code tools are accessible to anyone and can be used to solve problems without having to learn how to code. They provide an easy way to add functionality to websites or create interactions with viewers.
00:37:19 - The Importance of Having a Goal,
To effectively learn and use development skills, it's important to have a specific goal in mind. Setting clear objectives and learning the necessary skills to achieve them is more effective than aimlessly learning without a purpose.
00:38:08 - Empowering Your Team,
Business owners can use no code tools as an opportunity to empower their team and delegate tasks. This allows for leadership training and the addition of AI or automation to the company. It's a way to prepare the business for future growth and success.
00:39:26 - Quicker and Cheaper Solutions with AI,
AI enables quicker and cheaper solutions to business problems that may have seemed impossible in the past. Business owners should embrace the capabilities of AI and use it to improve their businesses.
00:42:35 - Solving Business Problems with AI,
No code tools, such as Zapier, Google Sheets, and Chatgbt Playground, can be used to solve various business problems. From automating follow-up sequences to integrating tools, these tools provide a stack that can significantly enhance business operations.
00:53:05 - The Evolution of Entrepreneurship,
In medieval times, entrepreneurs engaged in arbitrage by buying high in one place and selling low in another. Today, modern entrepreneurs play arbitrage with the future, disrupting industries and capitalizing on emerging trends. As a result, prices will decrease, but businesses will provide more value in the long run.
00:54:26 - Seizing the Moment of Disruption,
The next five to ten years present a unique opportunity for businesses to position themselves ahead of their competition. By embracing new technologies like AI, businesses can stay in parity and avoid falling behind. It's a crucial time to invest in the future and take advantage of the creative potential it offers.
00:57:35 - Being a Great Business,
Being a great business requires effort, regardless of the level of success. Embracing new technologies and adapting to change is crucial. The current wave of technological advancements presents a challenge and an opportunity for businesses to excel and provide value in different areas.
01:02:06 - Looking Forward and Backward,
Small businesses are essential in keeping powerful entities in check. Looking to the future while reflecting on the past can help businesses thrive. It's important for small businesses to have a voice and contribute to the development and improvement of our society.
01:03:06 - Connecting with Garik Tate,
If you're seeking to increase your business valuation or need virtual assistant services or product development, reach out to Garik Tate on LinkedIn.