Retail Self-Service Kiosks: Innovation Continues
24m
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COMMERCE NOW
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Summary:
In this special episode of COMMERCE NOW, Elliot Maras, editor from Kiosk Marketplace and Matt Redwood, Director of Advanced Self-Service Solutions at Diebold Nixdorf discuss the continuation of innovation in retail self-service and how self-service can offer a better customer experience.
Related Content:
https://www.dieboldnixdorf.com/en-us/retail/solutions/self-service/innovation
Related Links:
Kiosk Marketplace.com - https://www.kioskmarketplace.com/podcasts/expert-offers-insight-on-how-self-service-improves-the-customer-journey/
Retail Customer Experience.com - https://www.kioskmarketplace.com/podcasts/expert-offers-insight-on-how-self-service-improves-the-customer-journey/
LinkedIn Profiles -
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Transcription:
Speaker 1: In this special episode of COMMERCE NOW, our very own Matt Redwood, Director of Advanced Self-Service Solutions, joins Elliott Maras, the Editor of Kiosk Marketplace, where they will discuss self-service innovations, and how [00:00:30] retailers rely on self-service for a better customer experience.
Elliott Maras: Welcome to self-serve kiosks. The innovation continues. The consumers have spoken. Not a day goes by that a new self-service solution is not introduced.
In recent years, restaurants have taken a very visible role, introducing self-serve kiosks. In addition, retailers, from high-end department stores to supermarkets [00:01:00] to convenience stores, are relying on kiosks to serve customers faster and offer a better customer experience.
This past year, COVID-19 avoidance of human to human interaction has pushed retailers to offer more self-serve kiosks. I'm Elliott Maris, the Editor of Kiosk Marketplace. Joining me today is Matt Redwood, Director of Advanced [00:01:30] Self-Service Solutions at Diebold Nixdorf.
Matt, how did we get here? What did retailers see, that made self-service journeys so necessary?
Matt Redwood: I think one word really kind of encapsulates the journey that retailers have been on with self-service, and that's flexibility. When you look at the journey that we've been on as an industry with self-service, in the very early days, it was very much about [00:02:00] removing cost, removing labor, from the front end.
If you look at why retailers are really deploying self-service now, and how they're deploying them, it's really more focused on how they can deliver a much more flexible operating model within their stores. So rather than stripping staff out of the stores as a cost saving, they actually redistribute those staff. Because what they've realized is we've got to a critical mass now, where consumers want, demand, and expect a self-service offering in the [00:02:30] store. They very much see it as a faster, easier way of checking out in a store, that gives them much more control over the interaction with that retailer.
And that's a very, very important point, because if the consumer is demanding that, the retailer no longer has to push that as an offering that that is being driven by their own demands, and what that means is they can then take staff that would ordinarily be serving the customer, and they can put them into other parts of the store, to deliver the best consumer [00:03:00] experience. So if you look, a lot of data, particularly around self-serve kiosks, some of the bugbears of consumers is that they have to queue to check out or interact at the front end, or there isn't staff where they want it, either in the aisles or in the main body of the store, where they expect a good level of service. And self-service really ticks those box, because it allows retailers to put higher density of checkouts or order points [00:03:30] within the store. That in turn will reduce the amount of queues, increase the throughput through the store, so you get a better consumer experience, and it frees up staff to then go and provide a different functionality within the store, or a consumer experience, better consumer experience elsewhere in the store.
So it really delivers against the two big bugbears of the consumer, as well as gives the retailer much greater flexibility, and I think the flexibility piece has really been [00:04:00] key over the last 18 months, in terms of, if you look at the different changes in rules and regulations and shopping habits and consumer trends that retailers have had to contend with, the self-service device has really given them much greater flexibility to be able to deal with those changing trends on a daily basis.
Elliott Maras: Are successful retailers done, after they've implemented self-service across their footprint?
Matt Redwood: Absolutely not. So, the [00:04:30] really interesting thing about self-service, is that it bridges two very fast-moving industries.
One is consumers, consumer expectations, consumer trends, and the second is technology, and if you think about those two entities, they both move at an incredibly fast speed, and what that means is the retailer has to constantly move. They have to constantly change. They have to constantly adapt. They have to constantly upgrade and evolve their experience [00:05:00] within their stores, to keep up with both technology that's moving extremely quickly, but also consumer demands, which evolve extremely quickly. So I don't think there's ever a self-service environment or deployment that sits still for a very, very long period of time. It's a constantly evolving, constantly changing landscape, and retailers have really got to stay on top of that.
If you look at the marketplace today, it's very much about differentiation. So it's [00:05:30] not just about putting self-service devices into a store. It's now about putting the right self-service combination for your store, and actually tailoring that offering to that particular store. But more than that, what other innovation or other technologies can you bolt on to self-service, to enrich that consumer experience even even further? And I think there's a bit of a race at the moment for differentiation and consumer experience, so retailers are constantly looking, constantly evolving, [00:06:00] constantly adding to the self-service experience, to try and differentiate themselves and their brand from their competition.
Elliott Maras: If expectations from consumers are to be more in control and achieve greater speed and efficiency, how can a retailer improve an existing self-service journey?
Matt Redwood: So I think there's a couple of things to look at here. Obviously, a retailer will always want to sweat the asset for as long a period as possible, [00:06:30] but trends change. As I said, consumer trends change, technology trends change, and just expectations in terms of service offering changes within a store. So there's a lot a retailer can do to constantly evolve the self-service devices that they currently have in store.
I always say, which is sometimes an unpopular opinion, that the technology is easy, but getting a self-service device up and running is the easiest bit. Operationalizing that technology is the bit that really delivers the most amount of value. And if you [00:07:00] think about the moving parts associated with operationalizing a device within the store, it may be changes to staff, or efficiency of staff, and maybe different consumers, different proficiency levels, different times of the day, therefore different peak or different stresses on that particular store, and there's a lot that retailers can do operationally to improve the performance of the devices within the store.
The second piece is evolving the actual technology, and if you think about [00:07:30] a common trend that's talked about a lot, cash, the demise of cash, everyone talks about the demise of cash, but if you look at cash utilization from a global perspective, it's disappearing or not disappearing at different rates in different mar
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Thanks, Ryan. In seeing this data, I really had to pause for a moment and let this information sink in. It certainly is very interesting that in United States, the dollar amount spent with debit cards increased by 14% in 2020, and also that debit card transactions continued to outpace credit cards two to one, the terms of number of transactions. We may all have our own personal bias on preference between debit and credit and some of us may have a preference for using credit over debit for certain types of transactions, but we need to be careful not to our own views, to administer relevance of the data on the continued strong debit usage.
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Did the impact of the pandemic and stimulus money have some impact on increase of debit usage in 2020? I think it did, but I also think that the pandemic also accelerated the consumer migration to digital payment channels and debit is still the most popular form of retail payment, and it's not going away at any time soon. Once you really look at the information that Sarah summarized so well, it really makes a lot of sense, especially when including the influence of younger generations that are growing in importance and how debit is leveraged on a global basis. Close to 83% of younger consumers use a debit card and not credit and that's understandable at their age. Many may have not had the ability to obtain credit, and they also seen or heard so many negative stories about how credit card debt that they formulate a consumer behavior outside of credit usage.
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Yeah. Thanks so much for that. And really, I liked your overview, particularly the comparison with other countries. Certainly, I think the US is somewhat unique in its history, its legacy of being very credit card-focused that isn't necessarily the case around the world. And certainly, things like the economics play into that. The fact that particularly in the US, we really, really love those credit card rewards. So, it was kind of interesting, I agree, I think this was really pushed by the pandemic when we saw the debit card volumes for the first time tip over in above the credit card numbers. And let me clarify, looking at this chart, that we are looking at debit card purchases. We did make some calculations to extract some of the debit push payments, right? So, that would be MasterCard send or Visa Direct.
Sarah:
So, we're really looking at something closer to an apples-apples comparison of just debit card purchases from MasterCard and Visa in comparison to what's happening on the credit card side. So, I think as we look forward and as we start to see purchasing habits maybe coming back to something that looked a little bit more like pre-pandemic patterns, so more things like purchases for eating out purchases, for travel in particular, I think that we'll start to see the credit card numbers start to come back up again. But I do think for many of the reasons that you pointed out Steve, I think that we will still continue to see very, very strong debit card growth for the foreseeable future.
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Steven and Sarah, thank you so much for that. Now, to kind of just recap a lot of what was said there, obviously historically, in the US we have seen debit cards outpace credit in terms of transaction volumes. But also, then as we were kind of pointing out, in 2020, we did see that percentage gap changed dramatically with debit card volume seeing that 14% growth over 2019 numbers. Now, Steven, as you pointed out, I think that there's a fair amount of that double digit growth was related and due to the pandemic. And as Sarah kind of stated there at the end that she foresees this growth in debit being a continuing trend. But beyond the pandemic, are there other reasons that you could kind of sight or maybe glean to, of why it is that debit may remain a preferred payment method of choice for consumers?
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Increasingly we're seeing the payment become implicit in the transactions of all kinds of services. To be explicit, the payment is being made invisible. You can get a ride, a coffee, and a lot more, without pulling out your cash or a credit card.
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Tim Sloane: I totally agree with that. As payments become invisible and merchants want to make [00:04:00] payments invisible, you see the card on file volume starting to move to an environment where automatic acceptance is done. You also have voice payments taking place in an increasingly large environment, where they talk to their Amazon Alexa or their Google speaker, and they're asking for something to be delivered, it's delivered automatically, and the payment becomes invisible. So [00:04:30] how a financial institution can drive itself to be top of wallet in those environments is critical. And that's what's happening now. Further off, we see things shifting to IOT type payments where it's entirely automated and decisions are being made by the machine.
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Jens Audenaert: Yeah, it's a great question. And Tim, I loved how you phrased that as well.
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Jerry: Hello everyone and thanks for listening in. I would like to welcome today's guest Bill Inzeo Product and Solutions Global Strategy for Zebra Technologies. Welcome Bill. Thanks for joining me today.
Bill Inzeo: Thank you for having me.
Jerry: And we're also fortunate to [00:00:30] have Anja Popp with us. Anya is our senior analyst in Market Intelligence here at Diebold Nixdorf. Thank you Anya for joining us.
Anja Popp: Thank you, Jerry. It's my pleasure to be here.
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Bill Inzeo: Yeah, I think that's absolutely the case. Technologies that can provide really any level of convenience to the customers can be a draw and look no further than the checkout experience in retail in particular. There's customers that are going to select a retailer or certain retailers, not only for the types of products that they sell, but also for the [00:01:30] way in which they can actually conduct their shopping trip, especially in a post-pandemic environment where options like self-checkout are going to appeal to a subset of customers in a way that looks different today than it did in 2019, because there's a whole personal safety aspect and element to that decision-making.
Jerry: Interesting. Anja, what are your thoughts on it?
Anja Popp: Yeah, that's a great question, Jerry. And thanks for the insight from Bill as well. I would say yes, shoppers are drawn to certain technologies. At least if retailers manage to build an experience [00:02:00] that corresponds with each shopper's core motivation behind adopting a solution. So maybe if I may add a little color to my response, so we were specifically digging into technology adoption in the grocery segment. We had 15,000 grocery shopper voices from 15 countries in there. And based on all these data points, we were working with Nielson as our research partner to conduct a segmentation analysis. And that analysis actually returned five core motivations that influence [00:02:30] shopper interest in retail technology. And that would be ease. So really ease of use, simplicity.
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Jerry: Those are great insights. It's always interesting to see the march of technological advances and how it affects consumers and retailers alike. What about force changes now? COVID forced all consumers to rethink their needs, journeys, and what their expectations are. What's been impacted the most from this? Anja, what interesting findings [00:03:30] did we find with the Diebold Nixdorf/Nielsen survey learned from consumers? Did we see a change when we surveyed before COVID versus a year later?
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Jerry: I really love this data and I get to see it happen all the time. My wife can't stand self-checkout, but during the pandemic I think she followed your data. She went to it because of those concerns and she changed her behavior based on that. It was something she didn't do before and afterwards she tends to do more often. We learn more and more every time we ask the consumer direct questions. I love it. Bill, what are you seeing today?
Bill Inzeo: What Anja and I have been seeing [00:05:30] is very similar. When we're talking to our customers at Zebra and hearing from them, the challenges that they're helping their customers with, we continue to confirm, I think what everybody's keenly aware of, which is that the pandemic has been an accelerator of nearly all aspects of our lives generally. And that includes the tech savviness of the customers and the shift in how they are interacting with the retailers and how they're shopping. And that shifts in business to online shopping. And then beyond just the shift [00:06:00] to online shopping to the in-store or curbside pickup modalities, really out of necessity for our personal safety was the equivalent of a once in a lifetime accelerant. Well, we hope once in a lifetime.
And I think the motivation behind ensuring our own personal safety and the pathway to that being technology has changed not just how the customers think about how to leverage technology, but it's also putting the retailers in a position where they're starting to reconsider how they're going to leverage technology in the new normal, [00:06:30] and then help their customers along the way. And that additional layer of options for those customers, both to shop online and then pick up in the store in several different ways has created a new complexity for the retailers at their operation that they're still really wrestling with right now. And technology is going to be one of the many and probably the leading solution to that new complexity.
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Transcription:
Speaker 1: In this special episode of COMMERCE NOW, our very own Matt Redwood, Director of Advanced Self-Service Solutions, joins Elliott Maras, the Editor of Kiosk Marketplace, where they will discuss self-service innovations, and how [00:00:30] retailers rely on self-service for a better customer experience.
Elliott Maras: Welcome to self-serve kiosks. The innovation continues. The consumers have spoken. Not a day goes by that a new self-service solution is not introduced.
In recent years, restaurants have taken a very visible role, introducing self-serve kiosks. In addition, retailers, from high-end department stores to supermarkets [00:01:00] to convenience stores, are relying on kiosks to serve customers faster and offer a better customer experience.
This past year, COVID-19 avoidance of human to human interaction has pushed retailers to offer more self-serve kiosks. I'm Elliott Maris, the Editor of Kiosk Marketplace. Joining me today is Matt Redwood, Director of Advanced [00:01:30] Self-Service Solutions at Diebold Nixdorf.
Matt, how did we get here? What did retailers see, that made self-service journeys so necessary?
Matt Redwood: I think one word really kind of encapsulates the journey that retailers have been on with self-service, and that's flexibility. When you look at the journey that we've been on as an industry with self-service, in the very early days, it was very much about [00:02:00] removing cost, removing labor, from the front end.
If you look at why retailers are really deploying self-service now, and how they're deploying them, it's really more focused on how they can deliver a much more flexible operating model within their stores. So rather than stripping staff out of the stores as a cost saving, they actually redistribute those staff. Because what they've realized is we've got to a critical mass now, where consumers want, demand, and expect a self-service offering in the [00:02:30] store. They very much see it as a faster, easier way of checking out in a store, that gives them much more control over the interaction with that retailer.
And that's a very, very important point, because if the consumer is demanding that, the retailer no longer has to push that as an offering that that is being driven by their own demands, and what that means is they can then take staff that would ordinarily be serving the customer, and they can put them into other parts of the store, to deliver the best consumer [00:03:00] experience. So if you look, a lot of data, particularly around self-serve kiosks, some of the bugbears of consumers is that they have to queue to check out or interact at the front end, or there isn't staff where they want it, either in the aisles or in the main body of the store, where they expect a good level of service. And self-service really ticks those box, because it allows retailers to put higher density of checkouts or order points [00:03:30] within the store. That in turn will reduce the amount of queues, increase the throughput through the store, so you get a better consumer experience, and it frees up staff to then go and provide a different functionality within the store, or a consumer experience, better consumer experience elsewhere in the store.
So it really delivers against the two big bugbears of the consumer, as well as gives the retailer much greater flexibility, and I think the flexibility piece has really been [00:04:00] key over the last 18 months, in terms of, if you look at the different changes in rules and regulations and shopping habits and consumer trends that retailers have had to contend with, the self-service device has really given them much greater flexibility to be able to deal with those changing trends on a daily basis.
Elliott Maras: Are successful retailers done, after they've implemented self-service across their footprint?
Matt Redwood: Absolutely not. So, the [00:04:30] really interesting thing about self-service, is that it bridges two very fast-moving industries.
One is consumers, consumer expectations, consumer trends, and the second is technology, and if you think about those two entities, they both move at an incredibly fast speed, and what that means is the retailer has to constantly move. They have to constantly change. They have to constantly adapt. They have to constantly upgrade and evolve their experience [00:05:00] within their stores, to keep up with both technology that's moving extremely quickly, but also consumer demands, which evolve extremely quickly. So I don't think there's ever a self-service environment or deployment that sits still for a very, very long period of time. It's a constantly evolving, constantly changing landscape, and retailers have really got to stay on top of that.
If you look at the marketplace today, it's very much about differentiation. So it's [00:05:30] not just about putting self-service devices into a store. It's now about putting the right self-service combination for your store, and actually tailoring that offering to that particular store. But more than that, what other innovation or other technologies can you bolt on to self-service, to enrich that consumer experience even even further? And I think there's a bit of a race at the moment for differentiation and consumer experience, so retailers are constantly looking, constantly evolving, [00:06:00] constantly adding to the self-service experience, to try and differentiate themselves and their brand from their competition.
Elliott Maras: If expectations from consumers are to be more in control and achieve greater speed and efficiency, how can a retailer improve an existing self-service journey?
Matt Redwood: So I think there's a couple of things to look at here. Obviously, a retailer will always want to sweat the asset for as long a period as possible, [00:06:30] but trends change. As I said, consumer trends change, technology trends change, and just expectations in terms of service offering changes within a store. So there's a lot a retailer can do to constantly evolve the self-service devices that they currently have in store.
I always say, which is sometimes an unpopular opinion, that the technology is easy, but getting a self-service device up and running is the easiest bit. Operationalizing that technology is the bit that really delivers the most amount of value. And if you [00:07:00] think about the moving parts associated with operationalizing a device within the store, it may be changes to staff, or efficiency of staff, and maybe different consumers, different proficiency levels, different times of the day, therefore different peak or different stresses on that particular store, and there's a lot that retailers can do operationally to improve the performance of the devices within the store.
The second piece is evolving the actual technology, and if you think about [00:07:30] a common trend that's talked about a lot, cash, the demise of cash, everyone talks about the demise of cash, but if you look at cash utilization from a global perspective, it's disappearing or not disappearing at different rates in different mar
DN Partners with America First Credit Union
Summary:
In this special episode of COMMERCE NOW, we dive into the 25 year partnership Diebold Nixdorf has with America First Credit Union. Manish Choudhary the Sr. Vice President, Software for DN talks about how important connected commerce remains for banks and credit Unions.
Related Content:
https://www.dieboldnixdorf.com/en-us/banking/portfolio/software/payments
Transcription:
Mike: Welcome to our show and on today's program, we have Manish Choudhary from Diebold Nixdorf, Manish, How are you?
Manish: Very good. Thanks Mike, for having me here.
Mike: Oh my gosh. You're very welcome. We're talking today about your partnership with America First Credit Union, and Diebold Nixdorf, and just to kind of get a lay of the land here. Can you tell us about your partnership with America first and what you guys are doing?
Manish: Absolutely. Mike, so as you know, Diebold Nixdorf, is a global technology company enabling connected commerce for banks and retailers across the globe. Serving top a hundred financial institutions, top retailers. America First is a federal credit union with almost 81 years old institution with 128 location. It has the eighth largest credit assets in the US. It's the sixth largest credit union with almost a million and one members. Diebold Nixdorf and our partnership with America First is a 25 year old partnership where we recently announced our payment software, which will drive the payment transactions and payments switching capabilities with America First.
Mike: Wow. You guys have been with them for 25 years. Oh my gosh. That's quite a relationship. Well, I mean, that's congratulations right there for sure
Mike: So let's get back to the software part of it. So how does the software, how does this work for America First? How does it benefit them?
Manish: Yeah, so think about, I think if I were to double click on the payment conversation, so payment industry, as you know, is getting disrupted, it's getting disrupted because of new cloud technologies. It's getting disrupted because there are new real-time payment types, new contemporary payment types, which are evolving. There is innovation in speed of deployment, speed of consumption in the payment platforms and binding payment, which we've been working on is absolutely the right answer. And I'll tell you why it is probably one of the most contemporary payments, software implements payment, new payment types at speed and scale faster than anywhere else. It is a API first pure cloud native architecture. It is one of the most secure enterprise payment software available with scalable microservices. So from the credit union's perspective, it actually future proof, the technology and as the consumer behaviors are changing the credit unions as the, the consumers of the credit unions are looking for more and more new contemporary ways of doing transactions. This actually addresses today's needs, but it also addresses the future needs for America First and how the customers are going to consume some of the new payment technologies.
Mike: I mean, as you well know, I mean, it changes by the second. I mean, by the time this interview is done, something major will have happened in the payment space. So it's got tp be future-proof is such a key, key aspect of technology today.
Manish: Yeah, you're right. If you think about, you know, by the time we started talking and now there are millions and millions of new digital payments, which got processed and the banks really wanted a scalable infrastructure to actually handle those peaks and loads and balances.
Mike: So, so how is this going to help America First, obviously, obviously they're planning for the future. They're planning, they're being flexible. How else does it help them, you know, obviously be more attractive to members and, and whatnot.
Manish: Absolutely. So if you think about, as I mentioned, the, the consumer expectations are changing. We believe credit unions are competing with the large banks, and they're also competing with the tech coming in from mobile wallets and, you know, E transactions and others. So we at Diebold Nixdorf believe we really want to be at the right intersection of how to provide the right experience to our customers, to have them provide that experience to their customers. And in some ways, and I do believe like any other industry, the competition in credit unions that extremely high consumers switch between credit unions or banks and their, their experiences are changing. We believe the, the new payment platform really provides them. So for example, doing cardless transactions or non card based transactions, or enabling instant loans and instant payments in future or access to modern payment types,, you know, and I believe if the credit unions do not provide that somebody else will.
Manish: So in some ways we believe that this whole payment platform and future proofing, the technology opens up all of those avenues. So while it opens up the avenues for payment, it also seamlessly extends the traditional capabilities on the ATM side. So for example, America First is, is going to use the personalized marketing campaign to serve its customers, the seamless security, which is connected to the platform on the ATM side, also comes along with it. You can walk to a ATM and without the card, you can actually do transactions by using video technology. So there's a lot of enabling technologies and options that you get created with this new platform.
Mike: I'm liking the, what was the, the video technology with the ATM. And you can actually, how does that work?
Manish: Yeah, so the, the, the other part of our software is the modernizing the entire ATM stack. And we call them as digital value added services. So I, you know, I usually walk to an ATM and sometimes I have my debit card and sometimes I leave it at home. I can actually walk in, press a button, talk to a teller, verify my identity, do transactions and transactions and not just deposit and withdrawals. I can E-Verify. I can possibly look at opening up an account or doing some mortgage applications, right. With the channel. Then I'm able to talk to somebody or even a better example. I would say, Mike is if you're in New York city and you have you own 10 restaurants at the end of the day, you really want to get all the cash deposited into your ATM account, without giving passwords, pin numbers and account numbers. To those 10 employees, you can actually set it up on your mobile phone, give a QR code. And the 10 people can actually deposit all of the money and they can withdraw next day morning. And they're going back to open up the restaurant. So it's just enabling these small and medium businesses and the new use cases as self-service and digitization is becoming more and more common, especially after the pandemic.
Mike: I was just about to ask you, have you, is this all a result? I mean, this was stuff was going to happen anyway, but it really sounds like everything was accelerated because of the pandemic, all these really cool digital offerings out there right now.
Manish: Absolutely. Absolutely. We are seeing it globally. One of the advantage we have is, you know, the fact that you operate in a hundred countries, we can assemble the use cases and our learnings or what we are seeing. So pandemic definitely shifted. So the recent lockdowns banks migrated close to 70% of their deposits from teller to self service. And out of those 70%, almost 50% of those that actually aggregate get ATM's. Now that's a huge shift. That's a huge shift, which wouldn't have been possible. So this acceleration of digital transformation at credit unions and ATM, and I think we are at the right intersection and the technology is really, really helping in terms of accelerating those things.
Mike: And getting back to America First, and this is what America First is taking advantage of right now, right? So this is what they're going to be doing.
Manish: Absolutely. I think we are really, really excited about the implementation and our teams are jointly working together. As we think about getting the lining payments, modernizing the payment infrastructure, modernizing the ATM and enabling a lot more capabilities for future like cash recycling. You know, we're extremely excited about the opportunities, which a self-serve integrated platform is able to provide you
Mike: Good stuff, man. Any, any, anything else to wrap up? Because this is a very timely conversation obviously, and a lot of credit lines are going through this right now. Maybe not to the extent of that America First is, but I'm hoping that they will, you know, a lot of them are, a lot of them are on their digital journeys. Let's just put it that way. And, and a lot of them accelerated their digital journeys last year, but it sounds like really America First is really taking advantage of the technology out there to be not only attractive to their members, but to really, you know, compete with the big folks too.
Manish: Right. Yeah, no, absolutely. I think the only thing I would add to wrap up is I think, you know, we are extremely excited about this partnership. You know, we believe our, our teams, you know, my, my ambition is to really, really creating the most sophisticated payments software stack in the industry and writin